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The Modern Moms Roadmap to Balance Podcast
Is it really possible to find balance as a mom? Each week, I'll be bringing you inspiring chats, interviews, and dialogues all based around helping moms like you unlock their potential and lead the balanced life they want. If you enjoy listening to topics that help you lead a more balanced life, then you've come to the right place. I'm obsessed with helping moms lead the life they want without the guilt.
With the right information and support, you can find balance in motherhood without sacrificing your needs.
The Modern Moms Roadmap to Balance Podcast
Episode 40: Taking Back your Power in Motherhood: Letting Go Of Doing it All with Special Guest Dr. Whitney Casares, MD, MPH, FAAP
Imagine a world where the relentless chase for perfection is swapped for genuine, fulfilling balance. In this episode, we sit down with Dr. Whitney Casares. Dr. Whitney Casares, MD, MPH, FAAP, is a board-certified pediatrician, CEO and Founder of Modern Mommy Doc, American Academy of Pediatrics spokesperson, author, and maternal child health expert. She shares her profound journey from striving for an impossible ideal to embracing a more integrative approach to life. Dr. Whitney opens up about her experiences as a mother of a neurodivergent child, including a heartbreaking moment that led her to reassess her priorities and focus on what truly matters.
Mom guilt and societal pressures are all too real, and Dr. Whitney offers invaluable strategies to manage these emotions. From taking mindful pauses to consciously choosing moments of rest, she provides practical solutions to combat toxic productivity. Learn how efficiency tools such as AI can help streamline tasks and create a more balanced routine, offering a clearer path to a fulfilling life. Dr. Whitney’s insights extend to setting boundaries, and she emphasizes how small, consistent practices can strengthen self-identity and elevate our standards for how we are treated.
Rediscovering personal passions amidst the duties of motherhood is no small feat. Dr. Whitney’s latest book, "Doing it All: Stop Over-functioning and Become the Mom and Person You're Meant to Be," serves as a guiding light, offering a framework for joyful living. We also touch on the societal pressures faced by female celebrities and how their journeys of reinvention can inspire our own. To wrap up, we share resources and support available through various formats and platforms, empowering moms to lead their most authentic and joyful lives.
Helpful Links:
Website: www.modernmommydoc.com
Social Media Handles: @modernmommydoc
About the Podcast Host
Kayla Nettleton is a licensed therapist based in TX, business owner, mom of 3 kids and coach for therapists who want support and guidance in their journey in creating an aligned business model so that they can live the freedom based life they've always dreamed of without sacrificing their own needs.
In her private practice as a therapist Kayla specialize in helping women overcome anxiety, perfectionism and people pleasing tendencies so that they can lead a more fulfilled and authentically aligned life
Find Kayla on IG
@kaylanettleton_lcsw
@themodernmomsroadmaptobalance
Email: kayla@kaylanettleton.com
TX Residents can Schedule a Free 20 minute therapy consultation here.
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Welcome back everyone to the Modern Moms Roadmap to Balance podcast. Today, our special guest is Dr Whitney Caceres. She is a board certified pediatrician, ceo and founder of Modern Mommy Doc American Academy of Pediatrics, spokesperson, author and maternal health expert. She's been seen in the New York Times, the Los Angeles Times, forbes, parents, fortune, nbc News, abc News, today and more. In addition to Dr Whitney being a Stanford University-trained board-certified pediatrician and maternal child health expert, she is a mother of two and author of three books about the symbiotic relationship between a mom and child the Working Mom Blueprint. Waiting at Parenting Without Losing Yourself. The New Baby Blueprint, caring for you and your Little One and Doing it All. Stop Overfunctioning and Become the Mom and Person You're Meant to Be, which was released in February 2024. Mom and Person You're Meant to Be, which was released in February 2024. Dr Whitney practices medicine in Portland, oregon, where she and her husband raised their two young daughters. Thank you so much for being here, dr Whitney.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. I'm so happy to be here. Thanks for inviting me.
Speaker 1:Yes, and with every, with every guest I have have, I asked them this one question what is your version of a balanced life?
Speaker 2:yeah. So I actually don't believe in balance anymore. I used to. I used to totally believe in this idea of I could have a social life that feels like it's kicking. I could be like the best parent possible. I could be killing it's kicking. I could be like the best parent possible, I could be killing it in my job. I could be like the perfect spouse. I could have a perfectly clean home and trustworthy home.
Speaker 2:And the reality is of life. There are seasons and there are moments where I really believe that, in order to give your best to something, other things have to fall a little bit to the wayside for a moment. And so my version of like quote, unquote balance at this point and what it means to me, is really about integration. Like, what are the moments to push into something, to lean into something? When are the moments to lean out of something, and how do you know yourself well enough and give yourself enough priority in your own life to be able to do that effectively?
Speaker 2:And one of the major tools that I use for doing that is helping people to kind of clear away the clutter in their lives, and I do not mean in their bedrooms, although that's important too. I mean the clutter of all the to-dos and to help people learn, kind of triaging like we do in medicine what are the things that really deserve our time, our energy, our focus, and what things maybe have to get taken care of or somebody else could do for us. But they don't carry the same weight and if we put too much weight on them or put too much emphasis on them they can really drag us down.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they really can. And when did you first recognize that this needed to shift for you?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I am the parent of a neurodivergent kiddo. My oldest daughter has autism and before I became a parent I had been a pediatrician for six, seven years and, like you mentioned in my bio, stanford trained had a lot of ivory tower kind of advice that I was giving parents and once I became a mom that quickly changed in terms of like what actually worked in my life and as I tried to be kind of this hashtag boss mom and you know be on the executive committee at work and take care of every single patient.
Speaker 2:If there was a last one that needed to be seen, no problem, I can do it but then also attend to my kids' needs. It ended up that I felt like I was doing everything. Also attend to my kids' needs. It ended up that I felt like I was doing everything but really not doing anything. Well, and this common phrase that I hear from so many moms is like I feel like I'm giving and giving and giving, but it's never enough. It never feels like enough and I never feel like enough. And that's absolutely how I felt.
Speaker 2:There were a series of moments that made me really about reevaluate where I was putting my time and energy. But there was this one particular week where my youngest daughter she's not neurodivergent, she's about three years younger than my oldest and she was in the kitchen and she was, she loves, she's very physical, and so she was climbing on all of the cabinets and she would always do this for, like you know, and like get in trouble for it, and one day this three-year-old turns to me and goes you know, I do bad things because I don't get enough attention from you guys.
Speaker 2:And I'm like, oh, my gosh, she said that out loud. Oh yeah, I mean like the fact she could articulate it. She's always been kind of like a baby and an adult, like an adult and like a baby's body.
Speaker 2:But the fact that she could articulate and like, oh my gosh, I am, I have my priorities all screwed up Like here I am trying to make sure we have all the toothpaste ordered in advance so we never run out, and I'm trying to make sure that, like, my kids are signed up for all these activities and I'm trying to make sure that I'm, like, advancing career-wise. And I had to stop and think, like, what do I really want my life to look like? In two ways. Like one what do I want it to look like when I get to be eight years old and I'm at, like you know, birthday party and people are talking about me and they define, or they, you know, kind of crystallize what is the essence of who I am? Do I want it to be, oh, she's a really hard worker, sure, but I don't want that to be the only thing that defines me. Do I want it to be, oh, she had a perfectly well-kept house. It looked amazing every single day, like not really.
Speaker 2:Those things actually don't really matter to me at all I would never. I mean, they're nice to have, but I don't want that to define me. So I started to think about that. And then I also started thinking about and like motherhood is a long time 18 years or so was a long time and so am I going to hate my life every single moment of being a mom, cause that's how I felt.
Speaker 2:I feel like I was just trudging through, going through mud every single day to kind of get it all taken care of, and so there was like a you know quote unquote, kind of come to Jesus moment for me where I realized like whoa I have?
Speaker 2:I have more control maybe than I think I do. You know, I kind of always thought like everything is completely out of my control. Motherhood is just happening to me. This work-life integration thing is just happening to me because there's all these systemic issues that I can't really take care of childcare crisis, you know, inequities in the workplace, the fact that there's the mental load that the moms carry all of this I'm like gosh, like screw, that I'm not going to have it. Be that. That's my narrative, that just because those things are happening, then I don't live a good life. So that's kind of a moment that it shifted for me in big life terms, but then also in terms of my day to day and how I started living.
Speaker 1:I I love that you brought this up, because, with everything that is going on in the media about, about the mental load and about all of these systemic issues yes, we do know that there are systemic issues there that needs to be changed, but that shouldn't stop us from trying to frame a lifestyle that's going to work for us. And the point you made, too, was stopping to figure out what it is that you do want for yourself. Are you basing that off of keeping up with the Joneses because everyone else is trying to do that, or are you doing these things because that's what you actually want to be doing? That's what you actually want to be spending your time on and giving your energy to.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely. Last night's a good example.
Speaker 2:I picked my kids up from school and my daughter goes oh mom, there's the meet and greet for school tonight at six, 30, you know an afternoon and like first of all, I had to work from three to five or five to seven, so I knew I was going to be doing some online telehealth stuff at that time, so that wouldn't work for me. Also, my husband and I had a date planned last night to go see a comedy show. Like I had these things that I actually really cared about doing. And it's not that I don't care about going to my child's school and seeing her work, but I could see the teacher looking at me like, yeah, you're going to show up for your kid, you know.
Speaker 2:Like is this? You know? And I had to stop and think about like, okay, I could cancel my working hours, I could cancel a date so that that way I can show up for the five minutes to see my child's artwork hung on a wall.
Speaker 2:Or I could figure out like what's the version of this is going to work for me and my family? My child be just as celebrated by me saying you know, that's not going to work for me tonight, sweetie, because of some of the other things that I have scheduled, but I care so much about seeing your artwork, so could we figure out if we could take a picture of it when you bring it home? Could we go for a special ice cream date and you could read me the story that you wrote and we could hear about it that way so I think you're absolutely right Like trying to get away from.
Speaker 2:What are all the stories that were told about what it means to be a good mom and what it means to show up for our kids and show up at work, and instead redefine that for ourselves.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and also that it is totally okay if in the back of our mind, we're like I really don't want to go see five minutes of my child's art on the wall.
Speaker 1:And just putting that out there because similar thing has happened to us and we already had plans, or maybe we didn't have plans, but we prefer to do something else, and just making that decision like it's not that we don't want to celebrate our kids is you can choose a way or figure out a way to celebrate them in a different way that's going to serve the family better and even you, because at the end of the day, we still have to think about ourselves as mothers and there's going to be guilt that creeps up from that, because this might be something that's different for you. You might be someone, because a lot of the people that I work with they're also recovery people pleasers and perfectionists and they want to do everything for everyone, and so those things are probably going to come up for you, but that doesn't make you a bad mom or less of a mom.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I really love that and I think that's a great point. When people talk about getting rid of mom guilt, I think that that's pretty much impossible. I think that mom guilt is a thing because there are outside forces constantly that tell us we should be a certain way. To me, it's about doing something productive with that data that comes in toward us, versus letting it sink in and us internalizing it.
Speaker 2:So I did feel guilty for a minute, as the teacher's looking at me and my child's looking at me like, yeah, are you going to come see my artwork? And then I have to stop just for a millisecond and go Whoa, hold on, that's not on me. That's actually not my responsibility to do all those things. That's just somebody else's obligation. So and that requires which I think is really difficult for people in this day and age like that requires slowing down for a second and stopping and pausing and being with your feelings and recognizing like, huh, why do I feel guilty? Why is it that that emotion came up for me and do I need to take ownership of that? Or is that somebody else's bag that I don't have to hold?
Speaker 1:Yeah, absolutely. And what has been a way for you to slow down? Because, being in the trenches of motherhood, it can feel and seem like there isn't enough time to even just slow down a moment to recognize what is going on for us. What is it that we're thinking, and do we actually have the capacity, time, energy to do this?
Speaker 2:Yeah, my answer is twofold here. And you were talking about how you work with a lot of people pleasers or people who are maybe driven to have kind of that like toxic productivity of constantly working. Yeah, that is absolutely who I have been my whole life. I'm a type A person I get a lot of value for doing from being in action. I know that it's a way for me that I cope with anxiety is to keep on doing and staying in motion.
Speaker 2:So my first answer is recognizing that and when there are opportunities to keep on doing something, even on a free day, like I think your listeners will resonate with this when you have a day when you don't have anything that you're supposed to do, but somehow you can fill it with, like, either self-care things or with to do's that are for your family, in order to just fill the time Cause you feel like really uncomfortable, just being with yourself and being quiet.
Speaker 2:So, I might, if I have a day off, like go oh, I know what I need to do Clean out the garage. Oh, I know what I need to do, Like organize my sock drawer.
Speaker 1:I know what I need to do.
Speaker 2:Like you know, go to CVS as opposed to the drugstore, as opposed to saying like, well, hey, do I really need to do that? Or, b, is there some easier way that I can accomplish that task without it eating up my whole day? So that I have a moment to purposefully practice being quiet with myself? I have had to practice that. It has taken me going okay two minutes where I'm just going to be quiet and not do anything. Okay, I'm going to choose right now to watch this Beyonce you know a year of fours documentary that I found on YouTube for 20 minutes and lie in bed and watch that, as opposed to like paying a bill right now that I could pay Right, like those are choices that you can make when you feel that that urge to do, that urge to keep in motion that comes up. So that's number one.
Speaker 2:Number two is, like you mentioned, there are real tasks and responsibilities that we have on our plate that we feel like we can't just put off. Like, eventually you have to pay the bill. Eventually you do need to like do the dishes Right. So for those things, I actually use four different categories to kind of figure out solutions for all the to-dos in our life and to minimize their impact on us and on our schedules. So the first is what I call the non-negotiables, and these are all the things you have to do as your own individual person no one else can do them for you. Or you choose to take them on because maybe you're the person who's the most skilled in your family at them. And there are things for me, like as a physician. There are, you know, patient notes that I have to write.
Speaker 1:I'm the only person that can do that, or I'm at least responsible for making sure that they get completed.
Speaker 2:No one else is going to do that for me. I'm getting the laundry done every day. Let's say, you're like a single mom, you know, and your kids are super young and maybe you're the one that the only person that can do that. These are places where efficiency and productivity can come into play. So, for example, for the patient notes, I use AI to do summaries and what's called thought phrases, so that that way I'm starting to write the note and then I go in and I am editing it, so that that way I don't have to start from scratch. Right, the laundry, maybe you decide. Okay, I'm going to do it at a certain time in the week. I'm going to maybe wash and dry all the time, but then Thursday nights, from four to seven, that's when I fold and when I put away, cause we all know that's what takes the longest and is the most like a drink.
Speaker 1:So funny that you said four to seven, because I feel like last Sunday when I was doing laundry, I was just folding and it took half the day and I was like how did it take this long? And all the little kids were not even home. So yes, it can take a long time.
Speaker 2:Yes. So the problem is, though, a lot of messaging towards moms and business people just in general kind of stops there. They talk about like productivity hacks, about ways to get faster, to get better at our jobs, but if we keep on just getting faster and better, then we just continue doing more and more and more again, because we get so much value from doing so. We also need other strategies, so the second category is called the swappables, and these are things that other people or other things could be doing for you. So in my house, my kids are old enough I don't need to do their laundry anymore. It's great when they can do their own laundry. This might be like having Instacart go, you know, get that that body wash from CVS for me, as opposed to me going and buying it, because I'd rather spend $9.99 a month to have someone deliver that for me if I'm going to buy other groceries, that type of thing. So what are places where you can let go or where you can have the mental load be spread more evenly? This is a lot of the discussion that's kind of in social media right now about getting our partners if you have one, to do more, but I think, again coming back to the first point, you have to first, though, decide that your time and yourself, that you're valuable enough to not be the person who's actually doing it in order to hand it off to somebody else, because otherwise you're just going to keep going. So I don't think we can start with strategy. We have to start first with that decision of it's better for me, and it's ultimately better for my whole family, when I'm not constantly on a hamster wheel.
Speaker 2:So that's number two. That's a way to like get more off your plate. Number three is saying no, this is the not going to the 6 30 PM, you know, see my child's art. This is not signing my kids up for five extracurricular activities a week that I hate driving them to and they hate going to. And this is maybe not having so much stuff in my house, trying to clean out those closets, but like not for the fact of trying to get more, just having less stuff that then, every single day, I have to go around and clean up. So this is like the contaminators. Or is there something on my schedule or my agenda, for example, that doesn't need to be an hour long meeting. It can literally be a Slack message or a text message, you know, or a quick voice note, so that way we just have less that we're doing. And again that has to come back to I'm deciding I don't want to constantly be busy, I want to have a moment for rest.
Speaker 2:And then the final is the boundaries, and this one is, I think, the hardest for most moms, myself included which is deciding you're going to put limits on a lot of things, but first and foremost for moms, on taking the temperature of other people.
Speaker 2:So what I mean is, as moms, since we're caregivers, we're so good at kind of reading the room and trying to anticipate needs for our kids, and that's a great thing, but it then overflows into okay, I got to anticipate the needs of my partner, I got to anticipate the needs of my coworkers, I got to anticipate the needs of my house and so learning to set some boundaries around, am I anticipating my own needs first or as much as I'm anticipating everybody else's needs?
Speaker 2:Like it's just as important so that I don't have a migraine later that I got this cup of water and brought it with me to this podcast and took the one minute it took to go fill my cup and bring it here and drinking this entire time, as it was for me to show up for you and make sure that we're here recording this for moms. But when we're in that like do, do, do, productivity mode, we can say like I'll just put that off Cause it's not as important in the end, it makes us less effective. So, yeah, so those are the ways that I really coach moms on trying to eliminate as much stuff in their life, as many to do's in their life, and that leaves room for more of what we're talking about in the beginning, of the things that really matter the most to us.
Speaker 1:And it's funny with the boundaries because it is I find it it's one of the hardest things, or not one of the hardest things. It is a hard thing, but it's one of the things that people are most resistant to. And what I've seen as part of the reason is when people think of boundaries that you immediately think of like cutting people off or cutting things off when that's not usually the first thing that you're doing. That is usually like a worst case scenario Nothing is changing, and that, like you have to cut something or someone off, but it's not where you start, and I feel like that's where some of that pushback is when boundaries are brought up.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think that's totally true. The other thing I think that is very true is that I mean.
Speaker 1:The reality is, women are seen as more aggressive.
Speaker 2:They're seen as, like you know, b words at the office. They're seen as a lot of things when they set boundaries or when they decide like no, this is a firm no for me. So I think that fear of what will happen when I set this boundary is really strong. But I'm sure your listeners can think of a woman who's like formidable that they know that they don't even try to cross her because they know this person will never take stuff you know, like that person knows themselves. So so it gets easier, like the more that you set small boundaries.
Speaker 2:And that's why I mean like setting the boundary first, of thinking about your needs in the same way as you think of somebody else's needs, like this water. No one's going to come at me and go no, you shouldn't have water. But it's something that I would have never in my prior life like even thought of of, like, ooh, what do I need right now? Ooh, you know, like I showed you. So if you practice, then it will make it so that that's the type of person that you become and then you won't have that pushback or that resistance, because people will come to know you as someone who knows themselves really well and who has a really strong standard, or high standard, for how people will treat her.
Speaker 1:Yes, yes, absolutely, and I wanted to talk a little bit about your newest book, which is Doing it All Stop over-functioning and become the mom and person you're meant to be. So I find that maybe the question of what inspired this is a little bit obvious, but what inspired you to write this specific book?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I have written a ton about this topic in each book that I write in each essay that I write.
Speaker 2:This is like at the core of every single thing that I do with Modern Mommy. Doc is trying to get moms off that hamster wheel, living a life that's more joyful. But in all the other books that kind of alluded to again like strategies that you could use to do this, or about self-care principles that you could adopt in order to have your perspective change, what I wanted to do in this book is actually lay out my entire framework so that it was cohesive, so that people felt like, okay, soup to nuts, I know exactly what are the steps that I can take. So it includes those strategies that we talked about. It includes the self-care practices that I kind of alluded to.
Speaker 2:Number one, like taking care of your feelings. Number two, things like self-awareness who am I? What do I need? And then number three, self-compassion what are the things that I'm making mistakes at? That I can give myself a lot of grace about. And then, finally, self-acceptance. I had to really come to grips with. My child is not the child that I thought she would be. She's differently wired. Our life doesn't look the way that I thought she would be. She's differently wired. Our life doesn't look the way that I thought it would be, and so if I keep trying to create a life that I don't have, or trying to like, bang my head against this wall, I'm just going to keep on being disappointed. One example that I use in the book is my husband has all of this camping gear.
Speaker 2:He has like so much outdoor gear he can like own his own REI store and sell stuff out of our basement and reorganize our basement and so now it's all in one room like on pretty shelves, and I'm like, oh my gosh, this is a store, yes, but it's. It's ironic to me because the number of times that we have gone camping as a family is one. He's gone hiking a couple of times with friends. We've done outdoor stuff together. We used to live in Vermont so it was no shooting, so we have some stuff like that type of stuff. But his purchases do not just are not justified by the life that we live at all. He's. He's buying things for like a fantasy life that he doesn't have. And I'll indulge it because I mean, you know, I buy like heels that I'll never wear to a fancy party. You know, like we all do that to some extent.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, I have some in my closet. Yep, yes, but if that's how we're living our whole life, like signing our kids up for activities that they're going to hate, putting ourselves in situations that?
Speaker 1:we hate having a job that we're like oh, it'll all get better.
Speaker 2:Cause the boss will eventually treat me well, Like oh no, you know, or they'll leave or they'll leave, you know.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so. So that's a huge part of the book, and then the other part of the book is really redefining. Okay, fine, you've made room for all the stuff that you don't really want to define you, but what do you want to define you? And what I find from moms, and what's very clear in the literature, is that most moms feel this sense of identity loss Once they have their kids. They feel like they, they don't know who they are anymore, and so they need help walking through, re-identifying or reclaiming. What are the things that give them joy and I'm not talking about again. You go to an Island and you live with your like fantasy boyfriend on there by yourself. I'm talking about you know, like.
Speaker 2:For me, the things that are on my list of five priorities in my life are I want to have a connection with my kids that I'm, a relationship with my kids that allows them to grow into the people that they are meant to be, the best versions of themselves. I also care deeply about really supporting women and empowering them through writing and through speaking. I care deeply about travel and exploration and different cultures and different music and different points of view, with a comedy show can tap into no matter what's happening in my life, I can tap into those things and make sure that every single day I'm doing something. That is a part of those aspirations. And so yeah and I want to just point out quickly on the kid part, I know that can feel like, oh well, that's like it's whole, it's like a whole other thing. You know what I mean. Like like you could drown if that's one of your priorities.
Speaker 2:I try to pare it down in the book to these are the six things that it means to be a really great mom, no matter what kind of kid you have. There are things like building resilience with your kids, giving your kids routines to make it so that if that is on your priority list which my guess is it is on almost every single mom's priority list you can make that feel not so overwhelming and you can reflect back on that list to say like, okay, how am I doing? If I'm doing these things I'm doing all right, so yeah, so that's what the book is about. The book is about creating a framework that you can come back to as you're starting to. You have that aha moment, like I did, go Whoa, what do I want my life to look like, and also when you get kind of off the path along the way which we all do, but you can come back to to say, okay, this is wait hold on.
Speaker 1:This is what I care about. This is where I want to place my time. Yeah, that's awesome, because many of the people that I work with, many of the women that I work with, when they come in to work with me and I ask them what is it that you like to do for fun? Do you have any hobbies? What lights you up? They don't know, they can't answer, or it's all well. I used to like to read, I used to like to do this. I probably still do, but I'm not sure because I haven't done it in years. Yeah, and it sounds like your book could help them have this slowed down path to figuring that out for themselves and being able to incorporate those things into their life again, on top of whatever else they want to prioritize in their life those things into their life again on top of whatever else they want to prioritize in their life.
Speaker 2:Yes, yeah, for sure. And just a quick tip. I mean obviously in the book we go into it. There's also some great books, like like once you use this framework, there's a book called Unicorn Space by E Rodsky that talks all about this, yeah, which I love again, and even I have had great conversations about this. That's all well and good, but, like you said, I don't think most moms can approach a book like that when they're feeling so overwhelmed to go great, I'm going to find my unicorn space. I think they have to go like are you kidding me? I have five minutes today to myself, so what am I going to do in that space? You know.
Speaker 2:So, yes, in in doing it all, I talk a ton about little, tiny things you could do for yourself that could bring you joy, that can light you up, that can make you feel like oh, I'm me again. Things like listening to your favorite song in the car for five minutes before you go into the house. Things like I love to be outside, so I'll work outside on my porch instead of working inside. That gives me so much joy. Things like going to a spin class and being in there for 45 minutes and having the music be like as loud as possible If you don't know, one of the things that light you up.
Speaker 2:One of the best ways to figure that out in addition to reading the book, obviously is to ask people when do I seem like my best self, when do I seem like I am the happiest? When do I seem like I'm really full of life? Ask your friends, ask your family members, and if they say like, oh, you never do, okay, well then we've got to go back a few years, rediscover, try those things out and then, if they don't still let you out, you up. Okay, great, we can find other things, that, that but.
Speaker 2:But we all have inner things that put us into a flow state and make us feel like we're alive again. We all deserve to feel that way yeah, we all do.
Speaker 1:And once you start figuring out yourself again, it just will build and build and build and be so much easier to find those things, even though you can't find them right now.
Speaker 2:Exactly, yes, exactly, because, again, it's like a muscle that you work at the gym. You know, of course, the first time that you're doing like a bicep curl, you're like, oh my gosh, this is terrible.
Speaker 2:Once you've been there for three weeks or four weeks it's not so bad or the first time you go on a walk and you could only make it like half a mile and then you know you can go further, and further, and further. So you have to think about it like that, Like you're putting in the time to try to basically exercise your mind to think about things in a different way.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and also not being able, not being afraid to try new things because you don't know what you're going to like versus in the past. And also getting over enjoying the process and not necessarily the end result of those things, like a painting class, or I'm thinking of this in terms of a class. Sometimes people are just so focused on oh, I like I just couldn't do it right. But it's not about the end result of what you're doing. It's how are you feeling in the class with the people around you as you're working on these things, not just the end result yeah, and I agree with you, it changes as you get older, I think just because of, obviously, the way your mind works.
Speaker 2:you know, when you're younger maybe you're like more social when you're younger, but then now that you're being touched out every single day by little kids, you don't really want to be around other people. I have found that I've gotten much more introverted as I've gotten older, just because I need more actual physical space from people. So don't be afraid, I think to have that be different. That doesn't mean that there's something wrong with you or that you've lost some part of yourself. It just means that your needs have changed over time.
Speaker 2:I've also found, you know, I can no longer tolerate surface level conversation Like I can do it for a hot minute at a work party, but otherwise, like I can't, like I don't care if you're not someone who can get deep with me. We're not close friends, we can be. We can be acquaintances. We can say, hey, it's cool, pickup, but I'm not going to be your close friend, you're not coming over for dinner, we're not going to have a big get together, we're definitely not going to land any type of family weekends together, because I just don't have time for that.
Speaker 2:Like life is too like special and rich and beautiful to not have people that you feel really connected with. So if that changes for you, I think, just take heart. If it feels like, oh, I'm not the same person I was before, well, yeah, you're not. So of course your needs are going to be different now.
Speaker 1:Yeah, absolutely. And before we had hit the record button, you had brought up this very interesting topic about how the celebrities, especially women's celebrities, are continuously coming out as like, different versions of themselves. You can reframe that, because the way you had said it was great. I might be watching it right now. No, you're good.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, what I've been thinking about a lot lately is kind of a different take on this idea of constantly working being our number one place where we find value. So, like we talked about, women tend to fall into way more toxic productivity. We tend to be kind of like what would otherwise be labeled workaholics in our own homes and as we try to juggle work and life at home and it's for very good reason, not all our faults at all. The system is a hundred percent to blame. But what I've been noticing, and especially with the release of the Tortured Poets department and then also with Beyonce's new albums and these are people that I love and respect and I think have, like, amazing talent and I'm totally a Swifties this is not to take aim at them, but is that every single thing that they do it has to be a new reinvention. And Lorde's thought that artist also had a thing like three or four years ago where she came out with this thing where all of a sudden, she's like blonde hair.
Speaker 1:You know, Lady Gaga does this Like.
Speaker 2:It's not just those two artists, it's a lot of different people where, also, like, you put out an album and then the very next minute you put out another album. You put on an album and you have to put out 33 songs. You know not just like 10 songs it's never enough. And you know that these celebrities, obviously they have plenty of money, they have plenty of fame. It's not like they have anything left to prove. They could take a very long vacation and still live their lives and be totally comfortable. But clearly there's this driving power and some of that comes from this lean in mentality that the generation before us had to have in the corporate world of if you want to compete, you have to play like the boys and you have to do it even better than them. You have to sit at the table, you have to get the corner office, you have to be like so strong. But what I'm seeing is that the boys are no longer doing this.
Speaker 2:You don't see male artists, male celebrities, that are out there like killing themselves, breaking their backs to stay relevant. They're not doing it, and so I understand why this has happened and why, systematically or socially, we've basically conditioned females to do this. And yet I want to raise my hand to say okay, but what is that influence on the rest of us? What is that influence on the next generation of girls? To say this is how you have to be in order to be valuable, in order to be perceived as good enough, and when is it enough? And so it's made me just think about it.
Speaker 2:Not that I'm going to stop listening to any music or not go to any tours or concerts or anything like that, but just as a reflection of our society, that my hope is eventually for these celebrities that they can say, okay, I'm done enough. That there's some statement someday that comes like from them that says, like, okay, I made it, I did it, I'm good. And if they never do that, we can take note of lyrics Like I cry a lot, but I'm so productive or, you know, overworked and underpaid for 38 years, like Beyonce said and say well, I don't want that for myself and I don't want that for my kids as well, especially my girls. I want my kids, my girls, to have peace. I want them to have intentionality, I want them to feel like they have the ability to sit with themselves and be quiet and that they can look at themselves at the end of the day and say I did enough and I am enough.
Speaker 2:And to me that is the huge measure of success. That's what I'm preaching for, lack of a better word. And doing it all is like enough already, you're already enough. The inscription at the very beginning of doing it all, the dedication, says to Colette you're already enough. And people ask me all the time who Colette is. Colette is my name in French class when I was in eighth grade, and so it's like a love letter to myself, to be like a reminder hey, like you wrote this book and also you're already enough to like, just stop, you're good, you don't have to do more or be more to be worthy. And so that's what I'm hoping for all your listeners to.
Speaker 1:Thank you so much for that, and I didn't know I needed to hear that message, because my eyes are watering.
Speaker 2:I'm holding it in.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and just even thinking of like that little girl version of ourselves who is still trying to push and push and push, because for a lot of us, we didn't feel like enough, even as children. A lot of my listeners, I know, were people who had to constantly prove themselves or felt like they did to get the attention that should have been given to them, whether or not they achieved certain goals or achieved certain I can't think of the word. Anyways, continue to achieve, achieve, achieve.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah, you don't have to keep doing. You, we've done enough. You know, I I love Ali Wong. She always talks to the comedy thing where she's like I've suffered enough. She's like when my kids get mad at me, I just look at them and go I've suffered enough, I already pushed you out, I suffered enough, and like, yes, we've all suffered enough. Can we just stop and like lean into ourselves, lean into what do we be?
Speaker 1:yeah, yeah, and the fact that, like these artists are still coming up with these lyrics means that they feel the same way. They're suffering too. They're still achieving, achieving, achieving for a purpose, just like we are. And you're right, we, we are already enough. We don't have to keep proving otherwise. But thank you so much, dr Whitney, for joining us today. If people are wanting to get more connected with you, be in your world, work with you. What does that look like? What kinds of offerings do you have?
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely so. You can find me all my free information, blogs, podcast episodes. I have my own podcast called the Modern Mommy Doc Podcast. You can find that all at modernmommydoccom. You can also find out more about my books there. There's direct links to purchase the books. You can purchase the books wherever books are sold. This most recent book is available on audiobook as well as paperback and Kindle, which is great, really nice for working moms, and it's more of a workbook style.
Speaker 2:So sometimes the paperback is helpful, but start with the audiobook. I did not narrate it, but the person who did she brought me to tears as I was listening to it which was nice.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so find me there. And then on Instagram I'm at modern mommy doc and you can see in my Lincoln bio there I have a video on demand programs that you can do. I have free eBooks that you can get to get yourself started, so don't feel like you have to dive right into purchasing anything. What I want most is for moms to feel supported, encouraged and, most importantly, is for moms to feel supported, encouraged and, most importantly, armed with resources that will help to change their lives.
Speaker 1:Yes and again, thank you so much for giving us your time and joining us today. Thank you.