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The Modern Moms Roadmap to Balance Podcast
Is it really possible to find balance as a mom? Each week, I'll be bringing you inspiring chats, interviews, and dialogues all based around helping moms like you unlock their potential and lead the balanced life they want. If you enjoy listening to topics that help you lead a more balanced life, then you've come to the right place. I'm obsessed with helping moms lead the life they want without the guilt.
With the right information and support, you can find balance in motherhood without sacrificing your needs.
The Modern Moms Roadmap to Balance Podcast
Episode 38: Healing Birth Stories and Processing Trauma
Can the outcome of your birth experience define your worth? In this episode, your host Kayla Nettleton , is interviewed by Petra Cruz, the host of The VBAC Junkie Podcast. Kayla share's her deeply personal journey and professional expertise on overcoming anxiety, perfectionism, and people-pleasing tendencies, especially in the context of childbirth. Together, Kayla and Petra explore how societal expectations and upbringing shape women's behaviors and mindsets, providing healing and insight for those reflecting on their own birth stories.
Pregnancy can be a time of joy but also anxiety. We delve into common fears and obsessive-compulsive behaviors that arise during this period, emphasizing the importance of a robust support system and self-care practices. Learn how to trust your healthcare provider and birth setting for a healthier pregnancy experience, especially when planning a VBAC (Vaginal Birth After Cesarean) amidst the challenges of a non-supportive provider. We offer strategies to release these anxieties for a more grounded and peaceful experience.
Navigating birth preferences and processing birth trauma are no small feats. This episode underscores the complex decision-making process surrounding childbirth, emphasizing personal choice and comfort over societal pressures. We discuss real-life scenarios and emotional journeys, offering practical strategies such as journaling and specialized therapy for processing birth trauma. Finally, we celebrate the unpredictable beauty of each person's unique journey, featuring invaluable wisdom and tips from Petra Cruz. Tune in for insights and support on your own path to motherhood.
Helpful Links:
The VBAC Junkie Podcast
About the Podcast Host
Kayla Nettleton is a licensed therapist based in TX, business owner, mom of 3 kids and coach for therapists who want support and guidance in their journey in creating an aligned business model so that they can live the freedom based life they've always dreamed of without sacrificing their own needs.
In her private practice as a therapist Kayla specialize in helping women overcome anxiety, perfectionism and people pleasing tendencies so that they can lead a more fulfilled and authentically aligned life
Find Kayla on IG
@kaylanettleton_lcsw
@themodernmomsroadmaptobalance
Email: kayla@kaylanettleton.com
TX Residents can Schedule a Free 20 minute therapy consultation here.
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Hey everyone and welcome back to the Modern Moms Roadmap to Balance podcast. I'm your host, Kayla Nettleton, and today we're going to do things a little bit different. Here I'm uploading a recent interview that I have done with the VBAC Junkie podcast, which is hosted by Petra Cruz, and Petra is an amazing woman who is obsessed with all things birth, but especially VBAC. In her podcast, VBAC Junkie Podcast, she showcases inspiring VBAC stories, practical tips from professionals who champion the VBAC cause, as well as her personal journey and how it may help you and yours. In this particular episode, we dive into the topic of birth outcomes and how our birth outcomes do not dictate who we are as women. My hope is that you're able to gain some healing and insight about your own personal birth story as you listen to mine. So, without further ado, let's begin.
Speaker 2:Today I have an amazing episode with Kayla Nettleton, who is a licensed therapist, business owner, mom of three kids and coach for female entrepreneurs who want to support and guidance on their journey in creating an aligned business model so they can live the freedom-based life they've always dreamt of, without sacrificing their own needs, so important. In her private practice as a therapist, kayla specializes in helping big feeling women overcome anxiety, perfectionism and people-pleasing tendencies so that they can live authentically. And I think this is so important because it relates so deeply to birth and we actually really dive into this, you know, overcoming anxiety and perfectionism and people-pleasing tendencies when we're planning this dream birth that we're hoping for, and also really diving into how the outcome of your birth does not dictate the type of person you are, and I think that is so important to emphasize. So, without further ado, let's dive in, all right. All right, kayla. So I'm so curious what brought you into becoming a licensed therapist to begin with?
Speaker 1:yeah. So I really honestly have always loved helping people like that has been. A passion of mine is helping people, and one of the first kind of sparks in terms of maybe going into a therapy direction was my uncle struggles with his own mental health disorder. That I've kind of gotten to witness over the years and so that was my first like real life experience in what the system looks like and when I got into college. So I'm a licensed therapist and specifically my licensed clinical social worker. So the reason I chose that specific because it's very different than maybe the counseling route or psychologist route. Our studies is different.
Speaker 1:I had gone to college and because I am such a perfectionist overthinker I was, I wanted to make sure that I was making the right decision. So I went to this career counseling center that they had. I went to Baylor University and this is something that they offered to students and I took a bunch of like evaluations and personality tests and the person was like, okay, based on your, on these uh assessments, this is what you would be good at. And it was. They were all different. It was teacher, nurse, lawyer and a social worker and I can't remember what like the last one was, but those were like the top five and I'm like, because I was already going into the field of psychology, I was that's what I had signed up for in terms of measuring and I wanted to know more about.
Speaker 1:Okay, what is the social work? He goes well, you're in psychology, social work, you could do similar things. And he had asked me like why I was going into psychology and I said I wanted to go into counseling or I wanted to be a therapist. He said you can do this too. Let's look about. You know what the differences are. And so one of the main differences was social work takes into account a wide variety of systems. It's the like your environment, your person, the way you grew up. It's not just looking at like your brain and how that works. And that's where I fell in love and realized like I could do so many things in this field if maybe I didn't want to just do counseling, because I'm definitely a person who loves to have lots of options.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely and honestly. I love that so much and I didn't realize until you said it. But that is like so perfect and what we're talking about. Because when we're talking about like going into birth, like it's so much more than just like our brain, it's about like how we grew up, how we were raised, what, what was instilled in to us like values and beliefs, and that's how we end up viewing birth and going about birth. So, oh my gosh, I think that is like pure perfection. So I know you do help women. Obviously you're a self-proclaimed like people pleaser. So how do you help women when you know they talk about they're a people pleaser when it comes to their birth? Like, where do you think that particularly stems from?
Speaker 1:to begin with, If you like, really look, think about all like the people pleasers that you can think of in your life. I bet most of them are women. Right, that's not to say that there aren't men who are people pleasers, but this is really a personality trait of a woman and I really think it stems from as women. As girls, we're raised to think about other people. We're raised to not get in the way. Be nice, to think about others before yourself. Right, do like. The golden rule itself is like treat others the way you want to be treated, but it's putting others first. So I think that's really where people pleasing stems from is we're taught all of these things and as women, we're not taught how to take care of ourselves versus men. They are taught how to take care of themselves and how to de-stress and all of those things, which is why it can be so much easier for men to be able to put themselves first, because that is directly taught to them.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely. And I feel like you know this translates so much into like when we're planning our birth, because you know we have like these authority figures that are kind of like we feel like almost like a parent telling us what we need to do because they specialize in this specific niche that we're going to them to be seen for and so specific niche that we're going to them to be seen for. And so you know, when planning a VBAC or your birth in general, you know we go to these experts, we are listening to these authority figures and it's so hard to like kick those people pleasing tendencies. So is there any ways that you like suggest people or you know any tips you can give them to try to kind of get past those people pleasing tendencies to have the birth that they want to be able to not feel like they're tied to this, whatever this their doctor tells them they need to do. I mean, obviously if it's like there's an actual health concern, but if it's just like you in general yes, for I mean one.
Speaker 1:I have to put it out there. I would definitely find a therapist and work with them, because this probably is not just showing up in your birth. Planning situation like this is probably something that's coming up for you in all areas of your life, and this is just an area where you're noticing that it's a problem, but it's probably a problem in other areas. So I would very much recommend you seeking help from a therapist, because they're going to be able to teach you ways to overcome these people pleasing tendencies I like to say people pleasing tendencies, because it's something that we can overcome. This is not something that's like with us forever.
Speaker 1:Yeah absolutely and in terms of like the provider you're working with as a people pleaser, I think it's really important to find a provider that you really feel comfortable with, and I know that there's maybe not a lot of providers that perform feedbackBACs, but if you want to be more confident, you're going to have to find a provider who you feel comfortable with, who you feel is actually listening to you and that you're not just a number on their caseload.
Speaker 2:Yeah, definitely, because it does feel that way, especially when you go into these appointments and you're allotted like four to seven minutes with your doctor, so everything feels so rushed and then they kind of lead the appointment and then you're left with more questions than you came in with. So that's really hard, especially like if you said, if they're not like VBAC supportive, then that can make it even harder. Like, personally, I'm like I've had to overcome so many people pleasing tendencies in preparation for my VBAC and I never found a VBAC supportive provider. So it was like I felt like I was going to battle for every single doctor's appointment that I went to and that's not conducive to having like peace and feeling good about your birth. It's like you literally feel like you're fighting at every appointment. So, oh yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 2:I think it's a great idea to, like you said, get involved with like speaking to a therapist, somebody that can know your unique situation, your unique childhood, because I've even found, like, in all this work that I've done, so much of my people pleasing has stemmed from my childhood and you know situations that I've gone through throughout my childhood. Everything it was kind of like a step leading into these people pleasing tendencies. So it happens over time. It's not something that just happens overnight. So I think that's important to realize. It's not going to change overnight, it's a process over time.
Speaker 1:Yeah it really is, it really is. And one thing, too that I wanted to note you said you had to fight, like the providers, almost every appointment, and so when, if you don't get to choose a provider who is supportive of your plan, that's already bringing extra dread, extra anxiety to an already kind of high emotional journey that pregnancy is.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely, and I felt that completely and I even, like changed insurances and I saw like 10 different doctors and different practitioners throughout that journey. But, you know, my situation was unique because I did have three cesareans behind me. So there's no actual solid evidence on, you know, the benefits weighing the risks. So that's why I had a very unique situation. But now there is becoming more and more like practitioners that are willing to, you know, take on a VBAC after multiple cesareans. You know there's even like midwives, lay midwives that are willing to. Of course, some of these like are underground and they're not gonna, you know necessarily um, yeah, advertise that, but you know it is definitely possible.
Speaker 2:Um, so, yeah, but you're right, it does cause a lot of like anxiety and fear and dread and it's I don't recommend it. You know, definitely keep searching if you can. Um, but it is, it is possible, but it's not not easy.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I mean, like, use your network, ask people if they know people who've gotten VBACs. Ask, do a search, I mean on Instagram, really, like on social media. Do searches for people with providers who are supportive of VBACs, because when you find them and when you can connect with a provider that you feel safe with, it's going to be all of the difference.
Speaker 2:Yeah, definitely, and you know, obviously there's a lot of, like fears and concerns that come along with VBAC because of the risks that are told to us. So you know, if a woman is having fears or anxiety, whether she has a supportive practitioner or not, like how would you suggest that she deals with those?
Speaker 1:Yeah, so dealing with the fears and anxieties, so it's learning to sit with some of that discomfort too, because oftentimes we just want it to go away, right? So then we're just pushing things down. We are, and when we push down these emotions, these uncomfortable emotions, they just they're there still, but we're just trying to avoid them and ignore them. And learning what is going to help you sit with this uncomfortable feelings is going to be so much better than just trying to get over them, because there's no really getting over them. Your body wants to process these things. It's trying to send you a message, and learning to be curious with yourself, curious with these things is going to be key.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and so obviously I love how you said like they're felt in your body, because we do like these fears and anxieties manifest into like physical, like anxiety or pains or you know stuff like that. So have you noticed that a lot when you are helping women through these fears and anxieties?
Speaker 1:Yeah, oh, absolutely, and it can lead to almost like levels of OCD, like having to do certain things, having certain compulsions, so because there's just this fear if I don't do this, then this might happen, and so that's not healthy either.
Speaker 1:The ways that we help them through this is by looking at how our way, what are, what is, who is their support system, what has helped them when they've maybe experienced these types of feelings in the past, and looking at those, whether, because oftentimes, when we are going through a journey like this journey through pregnancy, yes, it's there that we need to take care of ourselves, but sometimes that's still not something that we do, because we're maybe so focused on work or there's just so much that needs to get done that, although we know we need to take care of ourselves, we're maybe so focused on work or there's just so much that needs to get done that, although we know we need to take care of ourselves, we're not really incorporating things to take care of ourselves. So, trying to make a list of what are at least three things that I know I can do that I already know help me to feel better, or help me to feel good in some way and come in and creating a plan where you incorporate those things into a flexible schedule.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I love that and it's like something that definitely helped me was doing like daily rituals and you know, it's not necessarily to say you have to do like an hour or two hours of a ritual. It could be five minutes, like I did, like five minutes of meditation, five minutes of yoga, just something to help ground myself and help me sit in quiet, because there can be so much noise, you know, especially if you have multiple kids and you know, you have a household, you have a job, like you said, there's so many things that want our attention, and just being able to like sit for those five or 10 minutes every day can be so helpful.
Speaker 1:And I think that goes back to another point of being confident in the provider in the place that you're choosing to give birth, because if you're not feeling confident, you're already setting yourself up to have already a higher level of anxiety going in, Right? So you want to have some sort of confidence, so that because one of the things that you want to have in the back of your mind is my, my providers are going to do everything they can to help me and my baby. And if you can't trust that, that's a really clear sign that you need to find another provider or another place to give birth.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and, and that's so true because I have, you know, had in-person clients that are planning a VBAC and their provider's not really supportive, and so they're having all these anxieties like, oh my, my doctor said I you know they're only going to be around on Wednesday, so I have to give birth on Wednesday. And then there's so much anxiety surrounded by this day and you know, we all know birth Like you cannot predict it, even if you get induced. An induction can take days, so you can never be 100% sure on that. And just like, releasing those anxieties and dealing with them is so important moving forward. Otherwise you're just going to be sitting in this pool of anxiety and that translates to your baby too, like they're going to be sitting in that anxiety too.
Speaker 1:So yes, I think that actually happened to me, actually my third, my third birth, so my third and last birth. Actually my third, my third birth, so my third and last birth. So I know I hadn't talked about it, but I have not had a VBAC. All of my births were vaginal. So this was my third baby. So I felt experienced, I felt confident in my provider in the process and everything.
Speaker 1:Well, my provider takes time off for religious reasons and my the birth was supposed to happen by the time he got back, but things happened where the timeline was not quite meeting up. Okay, and so I had to make a decision. Do I go with the provider who I don't quite like there, cause my provider wasn't an option anymore, cause he was on vacation? Do I go with this provider who kind of gives me the heebie-jeebies but I know he's going to do a good job? Or am I going to take my chances on the weekend with a random person? And I was like, oh man.
Speaker 1:So I had to go with the provider that I knew was going to do a good job but I wasn't a hundred percent comfortable with and I hated making that decision, but I didn't want the other like I. I wanted to be able to make that for myself, and it's hard because, like my other options were were not great options because of certain outcomes that have happened had happened with that provider, with a family member recently, and so I was like, oh, I do, just don't trust that provider. I need to, I just need to go with this one. So I had to make the decision to induce instead of chance, like my water breaking and going into labor over the weekend Cause my provider would have been back like Monday or Tuesday of that week. But I was like I don't want to go in with all of this anxiety and then maybe the anxiety caused me to go into labor. Right, so I, I can, I can definitely relate to that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, exactly, and I think you gave like such a great point because it's not to say there's a right or wrong way to go. Like, if you want to get induced, have at it. If you want to have a scheduled cesarean, do it. You know, because if you're going to have that fear and anxiety, like it's just inside of you, then that could be worse than waiting for a spontaneous labor. You know you could have so much more fears and anxiety compared to the fears or anxieties that come with a VBAC. So, whatever you decide to choose, that is the right choice. Like there is no like specific. This is right for you. This is wrong for you. Whatever you choose is right for you.
Speaker 1:So yeah, and almost tying that back into like people pleasing. So I'm really glad that you brought this up because I think oftentimes how it's framed is having a natural birth is the womanly way to do it, and if you're not doing it naturally, with no help, and maybe even in the woods, then you're not a real woman, right, and I think that is just not helpful because there is no. There is best practices, but there is no right and wrong way for people to give birth. It's whatever they choose is right for them.
Speaker 2:Yes, absolutely yeah, because I have seen women that go unmedicated and have beautiful births. I've seen women go unmedicated and hated their birth. They feel like they were suffering. And you know like opposite. The same thing with epidurals. You know, there you can have an incredible birth with an epidural or a horrible birth. It just depends on you like and what you want, and it's not to push you in one way or the other.
Speaker 1:It's like whatever you choose, whatever makes you feel good, that's great, that's absolutely great, and the reason I had brought up like tying this to people pleasing is because sometimes that will lead people, to lead women to make a certain decision is what is everyone going to think of me? Yeah, if I choose to have an epidural, if I choose. Or what will people think of me if I don't choose to have a home birth or if I don't choose this? And so those are the lines of questioning that is going through the mind of a people pleaser yeah, instead of what is it that I need to feel safe and secure and at ease as much as these as possible during birth or, you know, during that process? For me, yes, Perfect, perfectly said.
Speaker 2:I think that's great. So you know, obviously we're talking all about birth. So if someone they had their VBAC but it was traumatic, or say they ended up having a cesarean and it was not what they wanted they wanted that VBAC but it was traumatic or say they ended up having a cesarean and it was not what they wanted they wanted that VBAC If they're experiencing some type of trauma or they did not receive like the outcome that they were desiring, what would be a good way for them to help process through that?
Speaker 1:One way is allowing yourself to really sit with that grief. Because it's grief no, you didn't In. What I'm imagining is you had a successful birth and your child is with you and you love them. Yes, but you are grieving this experience that you thought you were going to have and that was taken from you in some way, because even if you still had that experience maybe you wanted the VBAC I'm trying to use your examples you wanted the VBAC and you got it, but it was not what you imagined. That's still an experience that was taken from you because it wasn't your imagined experience.
Speaker 1:So, being able to give yourself the space to grieve that experience, and because when we're talking about processing our emotions, it's really about feeling them and sitting with them. It's not about reliving the experience, it's really about sitting with the grief, sitting with that sadness, and talking to someone about what you wish that experience maybe would have been like for you, so that you can process those, or journaling about that experience. And this is not to say that that means you're ungrateful, it doesn't. We get to grieve in ways, no matter what. Yeah, because this is still a loss for you, the loss of a hoped experience.
Speaker 2:Exactly so you know. Say that they did the journaling and they sat with their emotions, but they still feel like I don't know how to get through this. What would you suggest that they do?
Speaker 1:I mean, if you are struggling with doing this, you know, on your own, again, seek out help from a trained therapist, a licensed therapist, because there are I mean, I know of some personally who are specifically like they are perinatal licensed therapists that specialize in helping women through these types of traumas or they're niching in working with women who have experienced birth trauma. So seek them out. I know they are out there and if you are struggling and you're listening to this podcast episode and, like I cannot find someone, you can reach out to me and I will help you, because I love helping connecting women to therapists that are going to be the best fit for them.
Speaker 2:Right, definitely. And you know I do always suggest women because we don't always align with even like maybe the first therapist we see or even the second. So just like trying out different ones if you feel like that first one is not really aligning with you, because I think there's so many of us out there and even if you're a perinatal therapist or you know, a birth trauma therapist specifically, you might practice just a little bit differently than that other therapist. So I think, definitely, looking at your options, and if that one doesn't work, I mean it's okay to go to a different one. I mean absolutely, I think. I mean I don't want to speak for you, but I would think therapists understand like you're not the fit for everybody.
Speaker 1:Yes, and that is that is absolutely correct, and that, like that really is something that I think more therapists need to understand is, yes, we are trained to help everybody, but we're not always the best to help everybody. Like, like the people I want to work with, I want to be confident that, like, yes, I know that I can like help you get the results that you want. Right, and so if I, if someone's like on a consultation call with me and I'm just like I don't know, maybe like, maybe I haven't helped someone through that specific struggle or something that might not, or something that might not be something that's the right fit for me, but I have such a great referral network and great relationships that I will usually be able to say, like you know what, I'm probably not the best fit, because maybe I've never helped someone through this exact experience that you're going through and I've never experienced it myself, but you know, this person is going to be awesome for you and if you want me to give you that referral, I can.
Speaker 2:I love that. So you know, if women are stuck on the way that their baby came into this world is, is there a way that you would help to like encourage these women or help them through that?
Speaker 1:yeah, it's. It's really, really digging into what does that experience say about you, because oftentimes we've created a narrative of because I didn't experience this. That means this for me, and really being able to dig into that is how being able to process and move through through that experience is going to be helpful because, you've created meaning out of it, and that's kind of where people will get stuck is now they're like, well, that means I'm this and they're struggling for that.
Speaker 1:they're struggling with that, but in the moment it's not always like at the top of our mind that we're thinking that. It's oftentimes like an unconscious label that we've labeled ourself with. But we are just so stuck on that experience itself and being able to say that label consciously out loud can really be helpful.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, I love that so much. And you know, one thing that I try to tell my clients is yes, you know, we want this VBAC. We're imagining it to be like this beautiful experience, but the reality is not everybody gets the VBAC. We're imagining it to be like this beautiful experience, but the reality is not everybody gets the VBAC and even if they do, it might not be what they imagined it to be. So I try to focus on the journey, not to negate what they're feeling. You know that is still valid, what they're feeling from that experience.
Speaker 2:But yeah like focusing on the journey. What did you learn on this journey? How did you change you? You spoke up to that practitioner and told them that is not what I want, and you were never able to do that before. Look at that, let's. Let's talk about that. Let's celebrate you. You grew a whole human like not everybody can say that and then you're now taking care of this, this beautiful human.
Speaker 2:You are incredible, like I just want to emphasize that it is amazing, like, yes, all those feelings are valid, that you're feeling, but let's still celebrate what you have done along the way and after, because it's incredible.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and oftentimes women who are struggling with this are struggling it, struggling with it on their own, so they're not talking to anyone about this. And when we're not talking about when we're just thinking about this to ourselves, we get into a lot of confusion because there is no one there to tell us otherwise. There is no one else there. That is like a sounding board that is really bringing us back to like the reality, because sometimes our thoughts will just go in a not helpful direction and then there's no one there to stop it.
Speaker 2:Exactly, yeah, and I know I definitely felt that way too, like I felt like such a failure after each of my first three births because, you know, I didn't, my body didn't do what it was made to do and where did I put that inside of myself? So I had all of this guilt, all of this shame that I was letting weigh me down and it felt so heavy and I was like lashing out, you know, and I didn't even realize why I was lashing out. I was more, you know, just like I had more anxiety, I was more, I was angrier and I didn't realize why. And you know, once I did process that along the way to my VBAC, I realized that's why, and I never talked to anybody about it because I was like I can do this on my own, I don't need help. You know I can do this, I'm a woman, I got this but it's just sometimes we do need help.
Speaker 2:It is so helpful to talk about it, to speak it outside of you. That kind of releases it from this place of shame and guilt. For me, that definitely did. It brought all this darkness into the light and I felt physically lighter, like mentally lighter. So I think just talking to anybody about. It is so helpful. Even writing it down, like you said, like writing it onto paper, literally putting that pen to paper and getting it outside of you can be so cathartic in so many different ways.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, and when you're writing it and if you read it back, you can be able to say like oh no, that is not right. Like what was I thinking? Like that is not, that's not helping me. That's not true, Because one thing to recognize is like our thoughts are not facts, their opinions, their thoughts, are not facts.
Speaker 2:Yeah, definitely. And it's like I also look at it in the way of would I say this stuff to my child? No, never, I would never talk to my child like that. I would not be like you're a failure, your body failed, you suck, you're a horrible mom. I would never say that to my kids. So, you know, I feel like we have to be more gentle with ourselves too, because we deserve the same love and gentleness that we give to our children, our family, our friends. Why is it we're beating ourselves to the ground when we're lifting everybody else up, you know, oh, yeah.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, and one thing I do want to know is it's not fair for women today to compare themselves to how women gave birth. Fair for women today to compare themselves to how women gave birth, you know, thousands of years ago, when there weren't all of these medical advances, because women back then giving birth naturally, in the woods, in the you know, wherever they were more in tune with their body than we are as women now? Yes, because it was just a different time. So it is absolutely not fair to to continue the narrative of this is just a natural thing. Your body will know what to do, but your body will only know what to do if you allow it to do it.
Speaker 1:Yes, and there's just so much that right now, if you're not in tune with your body, if you allow it to do it, yes, and there's just so much that right now, if you're not in tune with your body, if you don't have this relationship with your inner self, with your like intuition, you're going to get in the way. And so that's why it's not helpful to say like we're, we're women, like our bodies just know what to do. Sure, they do, but we can still get in the way and help is needed right now.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. Oh my gosh, you hit on such an amazing point because I so I'm creating like this VBAC birth education course and that is one thing that I put into it is how to hone into your instincts and how, over time, that is kind of been like beaten out of us. And it's not because it's been tried to beat out of us, it's not intentional. It's because we do have a faster environment, we have all these technologies. We're constantly do, do, do, do, do.
Speaker 2:So we're not honing into ourselves and listening to our bodies and like we used to, like you said, hundreds and thousands of years ago, because just of the way our society is and just because of, like, all the medical advancements, you know, yes, our body does know what to do, but when we're put in a hospital and we're put on a timeline and we have to give birth by this time, you know then that just like kind of pushes out all of our instincts and we can't hone into it because we have nurses coming in every 10 minutes, we have doctors coming in every hour, you know. So it's like it's not conducive to even realizing how to hone into our instincts. So, oh my gosh, that's such a beautiful thing that you touched on. I love it.
Speaker 1:And that's awesome that you're creating that course, yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, you know, there's so much that I feel like I've learned along the way and I want to help others because, you know, I didn't think I had the power, I didn't think I had, you know, the choice to do what I wanted to do. I thought I just okay, here I go on this assembly line and I just got to do what they tell me to do. Yeah, and there's just so many little things along the way that help us to hone into ourselves and that's like a real big focus of it is how to hone into yourself and how to like block out all the noise. And you know just like a lot of it is like mindset. It's, it's just about you. So that is like the focus. It's not. I mean, of course there's stuff in there like oh, here's some like labor positions, how to birth unmedicated versus medicated, how our body works, like the hormones, and like positions for pushing, and all that kind of stuff is included too. But like the main focus is like mindset. That is like my wheelhouse.
Speaker 1:I mean in all honesty, like the process of giving birth. It really is hugely a mindset thing and how we're coming into that journey, how are our, how we're coming into that journey, how we're thinking about that journey.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely, and none of us know how it's going to unfold. It's so different for everybody and it's so beautiful, and thank you so much for all of your wisdom and all of your tips. I mean, this has just been so incredible.
Speaker 1:Well, that was the end of the episode. I mean, this has just been so incredible. Well, that was the end of the episode. I hope you enjoyed this episode because I had such a great time recording it with Petra, and if you're looking for more podcasts like this or podcast episodes like this one, be sure to check out the VBAC Junkie podcast. You can find it on Spotify, apple or wherever you listen, and thank you so much for joining us today.